I am selecting shingles for my newly purchased 2000 built home. It currently has Certainteed fiberglass arch shingles that have cracks etc. They are called new horizon and certainteed is in a class action with this particular shingle.
I have selected IKOs arch shingle for my new roof. They are fiberglass based, not organic ( I don't know the line name, but am looking at dual black color). I contacted my roofer after reading negative reviews about IKO. He said that the negative reviews are for the Organic shingles, not the heavy weight fiberglass ones that I'd be installing.
He was not pushy as to what shingle I use, and I feel is pretty straight up.
I asked him about GAF Timberline HD arch shingles. He mentioned that they recently changed their technology to something that is supposed to be 'better' and much much lighter. He then said that he likes IKO because he's always felt that the weight of a shingle played a huge factor into its quality, and he was a little wary of Timerline saying theirs is lighter AND better.
My question is, should I go with the heavier and thicker IKO fiberglass arch shingle (not organic!) OR Timberline HD Arch?
I'm located in upper midwest (hot summers, cold winters)
Thanks and I really appreciate your opinions!
My roofer also mentioned that IKO offers a 15 year full replacement warranty, while it appears that GAF does 10 year full replacement on the Timerline shingles.
9 out of 10 roofs where people have the defective CertainTeeds, we install the CertainTeed Landmarks.
If I were you, I would stay far away from the IKO. Also, the bad reviews are about the IKO fiberglass shingles. Due to your contractor blatantly lying to you, I would hire a different one (btw, CertainTeed quit making their organic line in 2002). I would not be surprised if GAF is the one with a large lawsuit in the future.
Hands down, in our region (upper midwest) CertainTeed makes BY FAR the best shingle at this time.
Thanks for the reply. What makes the CertainTeed the best? What are the practical reasons that apply to me as a homeowner?
Is it the Landmark TL that you recommend?
Also, what are your thoughts on the fact that IKO offers the best (15 vs 10) 100% replacement warranty out of GAF, IKO and CertainTeed?
I recommend the regular Landmarks.
What good is the IKO warranty when there are NUMEROUS complaints about them not honoring it?
I can offer my customers a 50 year non prorated warranty that covers the entire roofing system in case of any defects caused by materials. On top of that, CertainTeed will also stand behind our workmanship for 25 years. Yes, this is correct. For 25 years, even if I install the roof upside down and sideways, CertainTeed will warranty to replace the roof.
Have your roof show up with some actual shingles of each and every brand. The way CertainTeed shingles lay in the field in nearly flawless (meaning all shingles line up properly and are each cut identical) feel in your hand (stronger quality than the rest) is why I feel they are more practical. On top of this, their parent company, Saint-Gobain (french owned) has been around now for over 300 YEARS. Certainteed themselves are around the 100 year mark. They have and are still paying on a claim, showing they stick behind the wording of their warranties.
Thanks for your opinions bam
Anyone else have thoughts on Certainteed Landmark VS GAF Timberline HD VS IKO Cambridge?
Please let me know as I will be making a decision within the next 24 hours.
Just reading a bit more:
"GAF also has the Golden Pledge warranty which offers 25 years of factory backed coverage on the contractors workmanship."
I'm leaning away from IKO, now, but have not made up my mind...
If I am able to go with Landmark TL over Landmark, is there any reason *not *to?
NOBODY will Warranty your install if it is not to their specs.
I think the best comparison: Take each brand and fold it end to end (Granular side up) on a cold morning 30-50 F. Then lay them back down side by side and see which one actually lays flat. Then flip them over and check for stress cracks.
IKO is our last choice- straight up overlays, terrible shading. Used to be the one, still is by many in our area but not me.
CertinTeed- even though I install a few of their roofs a year, the shingles seem soft, easily marred and thick enough to telegraph the under weave. I think the warranty is very complicated for most to understand, and explain.
Worst think think is the Programs- for instance...Joe Homeowner can take a online test to become a "Shingle Master" and if he answers the bonus questions -boom free shirt- great to wear when meeting potential roofers. A joke.
GAF Timberline HD with their well branded product line (Deck Armor- still the only "Breathable" Underlayment that I know of), Laminated TimberTex H & R, 4 color blend hides roof imperfections, minimizes shading irregularities and pattern repetitiveness.
The weight difference- lack of limestone- a filler with little or no benefit- which by the way promotes algae. If you are considering TL's consider Timberline HD Ultra- extra bundle per square, however much less money than TL's.
I agree 100% with what BamBamm said.
If you can upgrade to a Landmark TL by all means do it, it is an awesome looking shingle and very high quality.
Grab a Certainteed Landmark shingle and a GAF Timberline, the difference feels like Bristol Board (Landmark) and regular lined paper (Timberline). The GAF sealant may be a little better than Certainteeds, but the granule loss on the GAF is horrible.
IKO, huge granule loss out of the package, no consistency with shingle sizes, and pit's one of the only laminated shingles I know of that will show a pattern with it's colors.
One huge reason why manufacturers can/will void a warranty is improper nail placement. The Certainteed line gives the installer 1.5" wide nailing strip, GAF and IKO give the installer a chalk line (1/16") to nail on. One out of place nail could potentially void your roof warranty.
When it comes to ridge caps, GAF Timbertex is made up of 3 separate layers of material, with 3 caps per shingle that are perforated. You fold the bundle to separate the caps, and depending on the temperature, the 3 layers can and will separate. Certainteed Mountain Ridge is IMO probably the strongest shingle cap out there. It's a high profile cap that uses 3 separate layers like the Timbertex, but these caps don't have to be bent out of shape to get them apart. The Certainteed ShadowRidge is good quality low-profile cap.
IMO...Certainteed is the best, not because they cover their roof warranties... which is a very subjective statement, but because they have kept the weight of their shingles intact. Their accessory cap has the same wind warranty as the shingle (GAF does not). A ignorant homeowner can get certified by GAF with a check, whereas if a homeowner wanted to get certified by CertainTeed he would have to learn something about roofing first and that something would make him more knowledgeable than 80% of the roofing contractors out there.
GAF was the first to offer lifetime warranty on the exact same shingle that last year was a 30yr warranty. I feel that makes a huge statement about the character of the company (not that I think Certainteed is any better, at least they are upfront about profit and money being their top priority). Since they made the change in warranty they have started making their shingles lighter... I guess lime was ok last year but not this year. You pay for a certification from them, no roofing knowledge needed, just a check. The Deckmate is an expense that no homeowner needs.
IKO use to be neck and neck with Owen Corning for worst shingle. However; in the last couple of years they have been making strong strides to improve their reputation and quality. Unlike GAF they too have kept the weight of their shingles and they are considerably less expensive than the other two and they do have the 15yr warranty.
All of this is again my opinion based on 23yrs as a roofer and salesman... let me finish by saying, last year we put CertainTeed on my aunt's roof, this year we put CertainTeed on my brother's roof and next year we will be putting CertainTeed on my parents roof... and we won't be using the Diamond Deck.
ps... if you get your roof put on by a Select ShingleMaster and he registers you for 25sq of the 5 star warranty; even if he does install the shingles upside down, using bubblegum to hold them in place... CertainTeed will warranty the roof for the 25sq.
However; since the contractor electronically signed when he registered the roof and warranty saying he installed the shingles according to their instructions, installed the proper amount of venting, I & W and replaced all the flashing... they will at a minimum boot him from the program and most likely go after him for damages.
Well fellas, some lovely stacks of Certainteed Landmarks in Moire Black are sitting in my driveway ready to be installed:)
Thanks for the help!
If I had seen your post in time, I would've suggested just that: CertainTeed Landmarks.
That's all I've been using since I stopped using Bird & Son Shingles.
(that tells you how long I've been in the business)
IKO, GAF and other brands may work better in certain regions,
but CertainTeed seems to perform well in every region.
The install seemed to go well. The new roof has been on the house for a few months now. It looks nice.
Question - one thing that seemed odd - the roofing crew cut their own shingles for the ridges.
Through researching this install, I've come across the term 'ridge shingle' several times. Were they supposed to use a dedicated 'ridge shingle' or is it ok to cut a normal shingle into a polygon and use it?
Well, since they installed a CertainTeed Landmark that is supposed to last 50 years, they should have at the very minimum installed the "ShadowRidge" ridge cap".
If you saw them cutting shingles to use on the cap, the most likely used the CertainTeed 3-tab XT30 shingle. The 30 stands for 30 year. Now, why would anyone use a 30 year shingle on a ridge when they installed a 50 year shingle in the field? The answer is to save money. The ShadowRidge comes with a perforated line to easily break apart.
If this roof was installed by a quality contractor, I would not hesitate to call and ask them why they did that and demand it be replaced. They (the roofer) are supposed to be looking after your best interest.
As BAM said they should have atleast put on Shadow Ridge, but more fitting for a 50yr roof would be Certainteeds Mountain Ridge.
Yep, I think that's what they used. Is there any more objective reasoning as to why they should install the ridge caps? After some additional reading, I did find that some people use the method I described (and based on those resources it sounds acceptable). Other than the fact that the projected lifespan don't match up what can I go to them with in order to justify installing the standard caps?
Also, I'm wondering if installing the new caps will mess up the roof in anyway (prying old shingles off could cause damage, etc)
Thanks guys -
What reasoning do you need other than that it is wrong? Are they are certified installer of CertainTeed shingles? That method is used a lot and I can't stand it because it is wrong. Did you pay for a 30 year roof or a 50 year roof? It only makes sense in the cases of 3-tab roofs being installed to use it as cap. If you got the 3,4 or 5 star warranty from the manufacturer, there is not even an option to enter in 3-tab shingles being used as ridge. Yes, they do ask what type of ridge cap shingles are used.
I wish I got a picture of what I went to look at it the other day. A lady had a 17 year old dimensional roof with 25 year 3-tab shingles used as ridge. There was barely any ridge left but still at the very minimum another 6-10 years left in the shingle. The cost for the repair was almost 4k.
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