Good day.

I must appologize upfront for not reviewing all the posts on this thread...it seems there is a lot of good advise and warnings about scams out there! Good job guys for stepping up and notifying people of these things...it's hard for a scan to work when it's not 'hidden'.

Top 3 I've seen:

1. Asking for deposits up front while not being properly bonded. Home owners beware, ask for proper provincial (or state) papers required to accept progress payments. Many home owners do not know that roofing companies need to be bonded (at least where I'm from) prior to accepting deposits or progress payments. I've seen many and heard of many more a 'professional roofer' run off with such deposits...one such roofer even made the front page of my old local newspaper!

2. Plywood dust. My old foreman told me a story which I've heard repeated often enough...some scammers will say they replaced plywood on your roof (sometimes lots of it) and charge extra. This as a general practice is normal. However, the scammers lie about how much was replaced and sometimes even spread sawdust all over a lawn to make the semblance of lots of wood work. Tip: tell the roofer up front if he is going to charge for plywood replacement, you want to see pictures of what wood was replaced.

3. 30 day or first rain warrante...aka: tailight warrantee. Need I say more? Bogus warrantee's. Get a professional contractor who's liscenced, insured, has a track record and a warrantee contract.

There are some great tips about how to choose a good roofing contractor at the website http://www.calgary-roofing.com/6_must_haves_of_calgary_roofing_contractors

Hope it helps! And good luck! Roofing can be a safe and comfortable process.

Sincerely,

Eric the Roofer
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My two bits of the day...from a local Calgary Roofing Contractor. Strong quality articles about roofing at www.calgary-roofing.com

here in colorado I recently worked for a company that was scamming...i won't disclose name but they claim to be international claims specialists...what the international meant is anyone's guess.

they changed their name in order to continue their scam, I used to ride my K2 bike to work which was ironic because the name of the bike was eerily similar to the name of the company...

heartless cowards is what these knuckleheads were

Bruce LeBlanc wrote:

Well, maybe here is a bit of a twist. We know that many customers are scammed by many roofers, but what about the average experienced roofer who tries to go make some $$$ after a storm (IKE) by agreeing to sell/estimate for what he THINKS is a reputable roofing only to discover all the unethical and conniving methods that are being used. I went to Houston to make an honest buck. Worked my butt off, and was held in very high regard by the "sales manager" (jk). Eventually, I realized how two faced he really is and tried to get my jobs through to production. I left with getting shorted several hundred dollars on only 2 jobs and was promised to be paid fairly for my effort on my signed contracts.

Bruce, nothing personal @ all, but I have to say that this can often be the difference between a sales person & a contractor; the sales person may not be onsite & supervising the install & that can lead to a LOT of miscommunication.

How does the crew know exactly what you sold to the customer? Who arranges for additional "as found" repairs? Do these companies employ an onsite inspector who will also do parts runs? One reason a lot of hidden damage is passed up by the crew with something as shoddy as some valley metal over a rotten spot is because they don't want to leave the jobsite; they want to get done for the day & head home (I'm 99% referencing sub crews, & as mentioned thousands of times here, that's what dominates a larger percentage of the Southern market these days).

Maybe I don't install 250 roofs a year, but I have a much higher level of quality control because I try to supervise what I sell. After all, I am the one who has the relationship with the customer & not the crew.

In the end, it's my name & my ass on the line if things go wrong.
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Do it right the 1st time & there won't have to be a 2nd time.
http://RanchHandRoofing.com

These clowns have been know to work in your area!!!!

• ABC 3 TOP STORIES
Contractors Convicted Of Illegally Without a License


A Pensacola man is celebrating a court victory, this week.

Two men, accused of doing shoddy work on his business after Hurricane Ivan, must now pay him restitution, but what he really wants is to protect other potential victims.

"Offshore International" in Pensacola was hit hard by Hurricane Ivan.

The storm destroyed the roof and ripped through the building.

Owner, Thomas Brewer, was desperate to get it fixed, but he couldn't find a contractor who was free to do the work....until he came across Ceasar Sanchez and David Tywater, of Brevian Builders, in early 2005.

Thomas Brewer/Pensacola Businessman: "I was very thorough. I went on the internet, I made phone calls and I checked out what they had presented to me as who they were and they checked out perfect."

But the work they did on Brewer's roof was not.

Brewer: "Three days after the roof was finished and the check was cut, the roof was leaking."

Brewer was out nearly twenty thousand dollars.

It turned out the men were working under another contractor's License and all the paperwork they showed him, wasn't their's.

Even the building permit they had was fake.

Brewer called the builders for months and was finally told by one of their salesman....

Brewer: "Mr. Brewer you have been screwed. These people have done this before. They've hurt a lot of other people. They're going to do this again in the future and you've just been screwed and there's nothing I can do to help you. They've already left town."

Brewer tracked them down on the internet and spent the next three years keeping tabs on Sanchez and Tywater.

He worked with local, state, and federal authorities, but in the end it's what he found on his own that sent them to court.

Brewer says Sanchez and Tywater move from state to state, chasing natural disasters and setting up shop under different company names.

Brewer: "What I ended up finding out was that these individuals have got their own computer guy in Lake Jackson, Texas. What he does is he goes in and he sets up these nice, shiny web pages, very professional looking, to basically substantiate their legitimacy."

Brewer says once the complaints start, the websites disappear.

This is a website for a business in Mississippi established by the same computer guy.

Brewer called one of the contact numbers and got this....
"The number you have reached has been disconnected...."

Tuesday, Sanchez and Tywater pleaded no contest to contracting without a license during a state of emergency in Brewer's case.

They were sentenced to five years probation and court ordered to pay restitution.

Brewer says it's not about money, it's about justice.

Brewer: "Hopefully this might slow them down or it might save just even one other person out there from being victimized, once again."

The Pensacola attorney representing Sanchez and Tywater says had "no intent to deceive anybody" and were led to believe they could work under another contractor.

There are now several complaints lodged against Sanchez and Tywater with the Florida Department of Business and Professional Regulation.

Since Hurricane Ivan, the State Attorney's Office has investigated 360 cases involving contracting without a license in the Panhandle area.


Last Updated: Thursday, January 24 2008, 07:26 PM

all the time after a hail storm or tornado.you get guys in from out of town who pay an old retired contractor a percentage to use his company name thats been around for a million years.then they set up local numbers with the phone co.& letter the trucks with peel & stick vinyl or magnets.the kicker is they leave on the out of state plates!saw it happen out here in nh a couple years back,i even sold a few roofs for them!only took a week before i figured it out.i got screwed a couple grand in commissions.the attorney generals office finally caught up to them clowns too.they come in & grab all the roofs,& have mexicans & gwatos bang them out & take the money & run!they even 1099 me for that couple grand i never saw!

I wrote of a potential scam under Low Ballers topic. Please read.

pimjeg,i read that.i was driving around today pricing jobs & this forum question came to mind.i remember back in 1992 in s.fla./andrew,i was a young foreman & when tarping or repairing a home the neighbors,being doctors & lawyers would pull you to the side & ask you to damage thier roof too so they could collect ins. money.i saw dr. & atty. pouring water in thier tv sets & etc.just because the neighbor was getting a new roof for free they wanted one too.im talking coconut grove/coral gables these people had plenty of dough.again i saw it in the panhandle of fla.in 1995 hurricane iren hit in aug. & opel in oct.h.o. & property owners were doing the same $#@!.in fact my boss had us tear off the shop roof & dump it all over the trucks so he could claim it.im talking p.c.b.,destin,sand destin,&f.w.b.

corry newvill wrote:

all the time after a hail storm or tornado.you get guys in from out of town who pay an old retired contractor a percentage to use his company name thats been around for a million years.then they set up local numbers with the phone co.& letter the trucks with peel & stick vinyl or magnets.the kicker is they leave on the out of state plates!saw it happen out here in nh a couple years back,i even sold a few roofs for them!only took a week before i figured it out.i got screwed a couple grand in commissions.the attorney generals office finally caught up to them clowns too.they come in & grab all the roofs,& have mexicans & gwatos bang them out & take the money & run!they even 1099 me for that couple grand i never saw!

we just had that happen here with a 30+ year old gutter company frmo a small town 30 minutes north of tulsa.


i forget the name of the big company, but they came in, offered the old man 1% of their total sales for use of his name and logos.

they opened a nice big office, brought in 20-30 salesmen and a ton of crews, and knocked out all the big neighborhoods and as many of the larger homes as they could in 6-8 months, sold millions of dollars in roofs (i was told almost 40 million in sales in less than 9 months) and now they have left town, and that old man is responsible for warranty on every one of those roofs.

i bet he files BK in less than a year.

i only sold a little under 1,000 roofs in that same time frame with 10 salesmen, but im not going anywhere.... and thankfully now they are gone. i have almost 20 salesmen, and am going to try to beat last years record, even without the huge storm we had.
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-Jason

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http://www.ARCTulsa.com
http://www.myspace.com/arcroofing

agape,i hear ya.the guy who did it up here was tywater or tydwater or something like that from las vegas,nv,supposedly.anyway i just got a letter on monday from the irs saying i made mad dough from these guys in 2006 when we had a hailstorm out here.i sold a couple jobs for these clowns,when i didnt even get gas $ for my chevy p/u,i said see ya!they still owe me my 10 percent sails money,ill never see it.let me see that clown in a bar!

slaterock5 wrote:

here in colorado I recently worked for a company that was scamming...i won't disclose name but they claim to be international claims specialists...what the international meant is anyone's guess. they changed their name in order to continue their scam, I used to ride my K2 bike to work which was ironic because the name of the bike was eerily similar to the name of the company... heartless cowards is what these knuckleheads were

pictures are overkill u can look in a dump and count the old wood pretty easy

Putting money upfront is not a sign of being scammed. Most the roofers I know request half down to secure materials and still do the work.

Always have a detailed contract this is the MOST important thing.

I have done several jobs for companies who were "liscenced bonded, and insured" that screwed me out of my money for doing the work because they are crooks. There are more crooks in this business than anything.

I judge em by their hands if they have soft skin like a girl and clean nails I dont trust em.

Everytime I got screwed it was by a guy in a dress shirt and shoes, with pretty hands. They usually use some roofing term out of context and pop quiz u with what measurements you use and how u go around pipes.

I know majority of guys in this business know nothing of customer service...

SYS wrote:

pictures are overkill u can look in a dump and count the old wood pretty easy

Yes, but if you've got rotten wood torn out in the 1st few hours of a job, it will be covered up with other layers of tear off plus any waste on the replaced parts.

If the average customer is inside or not @ home all throughout the day, then only sees a near finished product, then how can they see if there truly was bad wood replaced (& charged)?

I take photos that show the roof deck along with the driveway, neighbors house, back yard, etc. Something that shows it IS their house that had the bad wood.
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Do it right the 1st time & there won't have to be a 2nd time.
http://RanchHandRoofing.com

Contingency Contracts!

Eric the Roofer wrote:

1. Asking for deposits up front while not being properly bonded.

This may apply in canada, but here, most states do not require a bond, and several do not even require a business license or even insurance to do roofing.


So dont lump every unbonded contractor in with scammers.
_________________
-Jason

______


http://www.ARCTulsa.com
http://www.myspace.com/arcroofing

I'm in Canada,never heard that one..i get deposits on anything over 50sq. usually..maybe calgary they have too i dunno.
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WHATS A HOUSE WITHOUT A ROOF!?!
Steeper The Better!!